Rabbi Herschel Gluck, OBE

This time, I had the honour of talking to Rabbi Gluck who is such a big force within the Jewish community of North London - mainly in Stamford Hill but he gives us a great insight into the history of Jewish people in Tottenham, the challenges, their solidarity in common struggles with the Muslim and Black community.

Shomrim website http://www.shomrimlondon.org/
Blog post (with further links and transcript)  https://anybodyeverybodytottenham.com/blog/episode-5-rabbi-gluck

.........................................................................................................................................................................................
pod instagram: https://www.instagram.com/anybodyeverybodytottenham/
pod website : https://www.anybodyeverybodytottenham.com/
pod twitter: https://twitter.com/AnybodyBody

Transcript

Jamila  0:08  

Hi, I'm Jamila and anybody everybody Tottenham is a bimonthly podcast introducing the good people of Tottenham to you.

Hello. In today's episode, I'm talking to Rabbi Herschel Gluck OBE and we will find out straight away that I have no experience in addressing anyone with an OBE. We will cover Jewish history in Tottenham, the work that Rabbi Gluck does with Shomrim and with the Muslim Jewish forum. And we will even talk a little bit about cakes at the end.

So Rabbi Gluck thank you very much for joining me on the podcast today. I'm very, very pleased that I got such an important highly esteemed Order of the British Empire with m e ...

Rabbi Gluck  1:04  

I'm not an order - if I was an order I would come with Amazon. I was made an officer of the esteemed order of the British Empire. The Queen herself bestowed upon me this honor, which I'm very grateful for, I didn't ask for it. I didn't work for it. But the Queen decided to bestow this upon me. And I'm grateful that she did.

Jamila  1:37  

So thank you very much. So Mr. Gluck or Rabbi Gluck, could you tell us a little bit about your connection to Tottenham and North London,

Unknown Speaker  1:47  

I've lived my whole life in what's known as Stoke Newington Stamford Hill, and Stoke Newington and Tottenham is a seamless continuation for me, of that neighborhood. We never felt there was a border between the neighborhoods, it was part and parcel of my childhood, that I used to visit friends in Tottenham that I use the Seven Sisters underground station that I visited synagogues in the neighborhood that I did shopping in the neighborhood that had friends in the neighborhood. So this was a very important integral part of the neighborhood where I grew up. I was born in 1958, a long time ago. And I've seen a lot of changes in Tottenham, and Tottenham has always been a part of my life. I spent a lot of time there and it's something which I feel very at home in.

Jamila  3:03  

Could you tell us a little bit about the Jewish history that you know, of the area? How long ago has it been established that

Rabbi Gluck  3:13  

Jews came to the area in a substantial amount since the 19th century, since the 1800s. There were a number of synagogues in the area, there was a synagogue in Lansdowne Road, which was called the Edmonton and Tottenham synagogue which was part of the of the largest body of umbrella, a synagogues united synagogue. And then there was also the Tottenham Hebrew congregation, which was on high road Tottenham,  the middle of the highroad there was a synagogue I lectured at the synagogues a number of times the and this the, the Edmond and Tottenham synagogue the rabbi there was rabbi Sonnenschein Rabbi sunshine. Nice name. And we, during the week, we used to pray together he was a very interesting gentleman. He has a very important role in the Office of the Chief Rabbi of the time, Rabbi Jacobovitz. And he invited me a number of times to lecture in the synagogue. I was very young in those days. He himself came originally as a refugee from Austria. He grew up in Vienna. His parents had come from a Galitia from Poland. And he grew up in Vienna, and became a refugee here in the 1930s. And he was a rabbi in the Tottenham Edmonton synagogue in Lansdowne road for many years.

Jamila  5:00  

So can I ask just as a aside: When did you become a rabbi? And what is that path? Did you become a rabbi within London? Or did you go to Israel? How does this work?

Rabbi Gluck  5:14  

I studied in France. I was in the rabbinical College in France for eight years. And then I studied in North America for four years.

Jamila  5:27  

Very international career,

Rabbi Gluck  5:30  

I studied in Montreal and in New York. I had the great pleasure of studying with the Lubavitcher Rebbe, one of the greatest Jewish leaders of the 20th century, and he encouraged me to become a rabbi and to take a position in London. Within that work. I have a lot of speaking engagements in Tottenham. There's also another synagogue in Tottenham, which is still a current synagogue. And that is in Crowland road not far from the overground station. And that synagogue is still a very vibrant synagogue, and the synagogue which is very well attended with a lot of services every day, and especially on Saturday and and the Jewish festivals.

Jamila  6:23  

Because what I wanted to ask as well is has there been a change of communities within the Jewish community? Because I know in Germany, the Jewish community started to really grow from a lot of Eastern Europeans, especially from he former Soviet Union, coming to Germany. Did any of that group come to London as well? Or is that not a big part of

Rabbi Gluck  6:48  

Not the same degree as in Germany. But there was a big influx into Tottenham following the Second World War, because where today there is the big shopping center, Tottenham Hale, that used to be an industrial park, there used to be a lot of factories there, including the Gestetner factory, which used to make photocopies and other similar products. And a lot of Jews worked in these factories. There is this myth about all Jews being rich. These Jews were far from rich, they were very working class Jews, they needed jobs. And they didn't have jobs in the east end,  so there was employment in Tottenham Hale at the time, because of all the factories, and they moved into the area in order to be close to these places of work where they found employment. Thanks, God. And, and that's why for many decades, there was a large Jewish population in Tottenham, because they worked in the factories, but then the factories closed in the in the 1970s 1980s. These factories closed, so therefore there wasn't the employment anymore. So therefore, people moved elsewhere where they could find employment. And also, I think, there were quite a lot of Jewish shopkeepers, a lot of the shops, small shops, there was the very famous barber who I think he was a barber till he was about 90, he had this barber shop, which was like a throwback to the 1950s. The barber shop was still unchanged, it was like going into a museum. And a lot of the footballers of spurs used to go to him for the haircut, because he was very nice. Now he was a he was like Hollywood, Central Casting Jewish barber. And the barbershop was like going into a museum. So it wasn't just a haircut. It was the whole experience. 

What do you feel are misconceptions that slightly frustrate you, were you just like " aaah", and you would like people to know this is just a fantasy. This is not true.

Ah there is so many like any minority community, there are so many myths. And so many misconceptions and so much prejudice that people have that you know that when you meet them, they don't see you at all, they see their preconceived idea of you and they don't give you any chance. They don't give you an opportunity to be yourself to be the human being that you are that they should be able to engage. Of course, this is a very generalized description, but it sadly it is often the case

Jamila  10:01  

But it's really seems in your career, that this is the mission of your life, isn't it? to open up other people's eyes to and to open up a channel of communication between different communities and your own community with the world? So could you tell us a little bit about your background what what you have done in relation to inter communal work,

Rabbi Gluck  10:31  

I haven't looked for this, but this has come to me. And I'm quite happy to have the opportunity to engage with a very interesting cross section of society, and to help them have a better understanding of having a better appreciation of the Jewish community and what it stands for, and what it is and what it does. And to enable people to feel able to engage with the Jewish community, and to work with the Jewish community for our mutual benefit, and for the benefit of wider society.

Jamila  11:16  

Could you tell us about two things, both Shomrim and the Muslim Jewish forum and what you do there? 

Rabbi Gluck  11:26  

Okay. I mean, Shomrim is a is an organization, which started originally in the United States to help bring security to neighborhoods where the security situation had deteriorated. And we work on behalf of the whole of society, even though most of our volunteers are Jewish. This isn't an organization just for the Jewish community. This is an organization which helps tackle crime and bring safer streets for all people without exception actually, over the past years, about 70%  of issues that we deal with on behalf of people who are not part of the Jewish community who are not Jewish. So therefore, Shomrim is an organization which is here for everyone and our raison d'etre is to prevent crime and if a crime happens to be there before the police and to deal with a situation till the police arrive then we do a lot of work of course in Tottenham, all over Tottenham, not just south of Tottenham, but further afield as well. Catching criminals stopping crime, patrolling and helping people achieve justice.

Jamila  13:03  

Yeah, so I have seen your work on Twitter, you're you're posting regularly there ,also to to look for missing persons sometimes.

Rabbi Gluck  13:14  

Very interesting thing because of course, missing persons. Again, we have many, many cases, form Tottenham - Jewish and non Jewish people who go missing. And of course, the families are very concerned and the police are very concerned. And we have a special mobile Center, which we take into which we bring into the area where we think the missing person might be. And we can have over 500 volunteers who are trained to look for the missing person. And to help locate the missing person, very often the missing people are very vulnerable, and they sometimes are suicidal. And therefore it is very important that we should get to them as quickly as possible, and be able to engage with them in a responsible and sensitive manner and help them in the predicament that they find themselves.

Jamila  14:09  

So how could people reach out to you apart from Twitter,

Rabbi Gluck  14:14  

Shomrim has a an emergency number and anyone can reach out to us and we're available 24 hours a day.

Jamila  14:23  

Okay, I will link this as well. 

Rabbi Gluck  14:25  

All our people are all volunteers. No one gets paid. We don't take funding by the government. We are a voluntary organization and we never refuse help to anyone, we are there for everyone.

Jamila  14:42  

Okay. And one of the things that is quite shocking when when 'm looking at your Twitter feed is how much anti semitic graffiti, people shouting abuse is actually happening. You know, you as a person you don't normally see this, but seeing it collected on your your sites, it's quite shocking. Now we've talked briefly before about this that you said in general, you felt actually, or in an article from 2017. You said, overall, you felt anti semitism has gone down over the last 30 years. But you also noticed a recent spike. Could you tell us a bit about that? 

Rabbi Gluck  15:27  

Yeah. So I think society has generally become more understanding and more tolerant of minority groups. But sadly, there is still a, a minority who, who still shout verbal abuse or Jewish people,only we have incidents daily, of people shouting abuse at Jewish people, of attacking Jewish people. So therefore, even though I would say there has been a an improvement in the general in general society, but there are still elements in society who feel that they can, that they have a right to abuse Jewish people, and to persecute Jewish people. And this is an ongoing problem. And I don't see enough work by the government, and by the police, and by the authorities in dealing with this problem. I mean, of course, this is something that we see very often against the Jewish community. But we see it also against the Muslim community, we see it also against the black community, and other communities as well. Then, of course, there's also a big issue with knife crime, and with shootings, I remember that I was invited to a vigil for Tanesha Melbourne Blake in 2018, I think it was that she was hit by a stray bullet, and very sadly, passed away. I think she was 18 years old, yeah, 17 or 18 years old. And I went to this vigil in the street, where she was shot, and I was so touched, and so amazed by the effect that the shooting had had on the black community, I was also surprised that I was the only white person there, I would have expected at a tragedy like this that  other people would also participate in this communal tragedy, where a young person get shot in a neighborhood, the whole neighborhood should feel that this is something personal, but sometimes people feel that they don't want to intrude or trespass, upon another communities sadness, and Trauer. But they were very, very pleased to see me there. And and they felt encouraged that, that they weren't alone, that other people also cared about what they were experiencing. But there was totally silence. The silence took me. And this is an issue which, sadly, is ongoing. And I think that we have a responsibility to find a constructive way forward, to stop the killings, to stop the pain of young people lifes being cut off in their prime. And this thing I feel very passionate about, and something that I have worked a lot on over the years and continue to work on.

Jamila  19:04  

Okay, can you tell us a little bit about the Muslim Jewish forum, how it came about, and what topics you have tackled? 

Rabbi Gluck  19:15  

I was very involved in peace work in the Middle East. And that's not just in the Holy Land, but in the wider Middle East. And also in former Yugoslavia, of course, including Bosnia, and it was a lot of work and a lot of work with members of the Muslim community as well. And thank God we achieved we achieved a tremendous amount. And then I thought to myself, "hang on a second. Your home is in London. Is everything okay in the UK?" and I thought to myself, "yes, generally, the relation between the Muslim community and the Jewish people was good. But I felt if there's going to be tensions in the future, because of course, the world was involved in many conflicts in the Middle East. And there were a lot of tensions. And I was afraid that unless we establish something firm, to hold the communities together, that these tensions could tear the communities apart and harm the good relations that existed. So therefore, in 2000, before the Twin Towers, before many terrorist attacks, and before the many wars in the Middle East, I spoke to members of the Jewish community and we spoke to members of the Muslim community about setting up something like this. And everyone was very happy about the idea. And the beginning of 2001, we set up the Muslim Jewish forum, the first type of organization like this in the world, and we work on issues of common interest, of common concern, we work regarding housing for the communities, the community have a tradition of having a lot of children, of having extended families, of having one's parents living with them. So therefore, there are specific needs for housing. There are issues regarding education, because both communities want to ensure that the children have an opportunity to know their traditions, to have an appreciation of their ways of life. Then issues regarding relations with the police or with authorities, the issues regarding burial, because, of course, both communities are very, very particular, that the loved one should be buried as quickly as possible.

Jamila  22:05  

 I was wondering, actually, about this point, of these points, how both the Jewish and the Muslim community were disproportionately affected by the pandemic, because of a lot of the reasons that you mentioned, the housing, the intergenerational living, etc. So how has this been?

Rabbi Gluck  22:28  

 I mean, that I know of families who live in two bedroom flats with 8 children. Not because they want to - overcrowding, there's a lot of overcrowding, and there is a desperate need, an important need to provide suitable housing for families, that they should, that they should be able to have decent homes, and they should be able to live in places where they feel comfortable. I think it's very important for everyone and actually tomorrow morning, I have a meeting with people from planning. And I've worked with them for many years, to ensure that people from all communities, not just from the Muslim and Jewish communities, people from all communities should be able to have homes in places where they want to live. That's very often - people want to have homes close to their parents, the want that the children should live close to them. But there are no opportunities. And I think it's imperative, we should try our best. I'm not saying that we can solve all the problems, but there needs to be a will. There needs to be an understanding and sympathy for people that they should be able to live in places where they feel comfortable where they feel at home.

Jamila  23:54  

So what about the top tips? Shall we do food? Where can we get some good food in Tottenham, extending it to North London?

Rabbi Gluck  24:04  

I mean, you mean you have a large kosher hypermarket in Tottenham where many members of the Jewish community shop and this is open for everyone. Everyone can go in there, you don't have to buy you can look around. And if they have things that you like, that take your fancy, I'm sure they will be very, very happy to serve you. And that you should be able to buy things to your heart's desire.

Jamila  24:34  

Where is it exactly?

Rabbi Gluck  24:36  

I understand that you've gone past it a number of times.

Jamila  24:39  

Is it on West green road? 

Rabbi Gluck  24:41  

Yes. 

Jamila  24:42  

Yeah, like near Phillip lane. So any snacks we should be looking out for? 

Rabbi Gluck  24:48  

That depends on your taste and individual taste. 

Jamila  24:55  

Okay. Any other bakeries? I know you've got a patisserie?

Rabbi Gluck  25:01  

But it isn't in Tottenham, but there are shops in Tottenham that sell cakes for my patisserie especially in South Tottenham. There are a number of Jewish grocery stores that's that sell cakes and biscuits from Parkway patisserie and they are very popular. Because of course, many of these recipes, and the types of cakes are Central European recipes. So therefore people from Germany from Austria from Poland, from other parts of eastern Europe, from Hungary, Czech Republic and Slovakia feel very much at home with these types of patisserie and baked goods, because this is using old traditional recipes, and making cakes and baked goods, which everyone feels very at home with family like schwarzwald, Sacher Torte, and all different types- Linser Torte all over the world.

Jamila  26:14  

Thank you very much for joining me on the podcast. 

Rabbi Gluck  26:19  

My best wishes to all the people in your school.

Jamila  26:24  

After a great start, that was also a fantastic ending to the podcast episode. I'm going to link the Shomrim website into the show notes. And remember as well that for each episode, I do a blog post. And I have already written about the history of some of the factories, the Jewish factories in Tottenham Hale which is very, very interesting. So check this out as well on the website. Anybodyeverybodytottenham.com. And just to clarify as well - episodes come out every two weeks on a Thursday. I hope you enjoyed today's episode, learned something new, and let that Tottenham love row. Take care and until next time, bye

Transcribed by https://otter.ai